Neutech TuBliss (semi bliss)

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erniebearskin
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Neutech TuBliss (semi bliss)

Post by erniebearskin »

So I have been running 2nd Gen Tubliss since late April. And it has some pretty sweet upsides, better bump absorption, more traction with lower pressures and tire changes are a total cinch compared to heavy duty tubes. Apparently some weight benefit but I'm not keen enough to notice that.

However on the 8 or so rides I've done on the Tubliss I've flatted 3 times, 2 fronts and 1 rear. I'm currently running Dunlop AT81's (the last two flats I added about 200ml's of Stans sealant, which obviously wasn't enough as the front had none inside when I pulled it off tonight).

This last flat was a front and it had three good sized holes on the edge of the tire. Beauty of this system is I ran at my regular pace for the rest of the ride (about 15/20k back to the trucks) on a complete flat with no issues/damage to the rim or inner liner, this benefit was the main reason I decided to try Tubliss. I just don't want to be demonstrating the benefit every third ride :blush:

I'm wondering if that tire is simply too soft to run lower pressures (I was running about 10 front 8 rear). I've never had a problem with those pressures will running UHD tubes, maybe the tubes add some stability/rigidity?

Anyway I'm wondering if any Tubliss riders have recommendations for tires that work particularly well with the system, my budd Bob runs M5B and M12 front which I've used in the past and am ok with using again, just thought I'd pole the masses. Couple of folks on Thumper Talk recommend running a desert tire with 4-6lbs?

Thanks in advance, B. :cheers:
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Re: Neutech TuBliss (semi bliss)

Post by axel99 »

I have always had good success with m12 front and maxxis 100/100 rear. I also run 12psi in the front and 8 to 10 in the rear without any sidewall puncture issues other than barb wire.
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Re: Neutech TuBliss (semi bliss)

Post by Jonny5 »

I have seen a lot of chat on the Internet with guys running a desert rear and no air, sounds pretty bomb proof.

http://youtu.be/YTGjkAyWXHs" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Not sure what to do about the front? Maybe you should slow down and stop hitting things so hard. :thumbsup:

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Dave8444
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Re: Neutech TuBliss (semi bliss)

Post by Dave8444 »

In my opinion the system does work when you are on a mx track but not where we ride.
If you are the least bit aggressive you will continue to have failures. I had no luck with green slim etc. The more ply tire you use the less feel you have and less traction. Also, the weight you save you add back with the tires extra ply. I put holes in both tires mentioned and also a Golden. The other problem is that as you ride more with a tubeless, you end up with debris in the bead and over time it starts to add to the problem.
The tires we can obtain are designed to be used with tubes. I believe the ultra is the best option as you can run a lower pressure and will see greater traction. I push the 6 to 8 PSI range with ultra tubes. I found that I destroyed the ultra tubes with the low pressures. It will alway be a trade off with any of these systems and I just change them regularly. I'm sure there are others on this forum who have more input but this is my opinion!
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Re: Neutech TuBliss (semi bliss)

Post by Metastable »

I just bought a bike that came with them and the front isn't holding air. I did some gentle riding with it today (after pumping the front) more so to get a feel for the bike. Anyway, sure enough it went flat during the ride. From my ride today when it lost air, I didn't like the front end feel.... maybe it's just me having spent too much time on paved tracks, but I don't feel too comfy with a vague front end.

Just saw an interesting article:

http://advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=831867" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

A friend of mine did rave about the slime and also mentioned that install is critical. Having said that he rides in Ontario, so not as rocky as what we have.

Another good one from dirt rider channel:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yBIaEL9yXX4" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

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Re: Neutech TuBliss (semi bliss)

Post by axel99 »

No air in the front sucks, it just rolls on the sidwall.
If you are rough with the tire bead when mounting you are more likley to have issues, some stans sealant or slime may help (I have had limited success with these products). I havent had many issues with new tires its usually the remounts. Also use silicone spray on the red outer bladder to allow good seating. I have a tubliss that has held air in a used tire for 4 weeks. Anyway, lots of different tricks and techniques to make them work. You dont know if the previous owner knew what he was doing and just messed it all up, pull it apart and inspect the outer bladder for damage and check the inside of the tire bead for tears when it was possibly forced on with 24" tire irons :crazy:
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Re: Neutech TuBliss (semi bliss)

Post by Dobi »

I gave up on my Tubliss for the same reasons. I kept blowing the sidewalls out and having flat tires. It cost me 2 races and I finally gave up. No amount of slime ever helped. It only made for a nasty clean up.

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Re: Neutech TuBliss (semi bliss)

Post by takethebounce »

Dave8444 wrote:In my opinion the system does work when you are on a mx track but not where we ride.
If you are the least bit aggressive you will continue to have failures. I had no luck with green slim etc. The more ply tire you use the less feel you have and less traction. Also, the weight you save you add back with the tires extra ply. I put holes in both tires mentioned and also a Golden. The other problem is that as you ride more with a tubeless, you end up with debris in the bead and over time it starts to add to the problem.
The tires we can obtain are designed to be used with tubes. I believe the ultra is the best option as you can run a lower pressure and will see greater traction. I push the 6 to 8 PSI range with ultra tubes. I found that I destroyed the ultra tubes with the low pressures. It will alway be a trade off with any of these systems and I just change them regularly. I'm sure there are others on this forum who have more input but this is my opinion!
Dave
This isn't answering the main questions, but the largest issues with the Ultra HD tubes is that they migrate with low pressure. I find the HD last longer than the UHD I have had better luck against flats with heavy duty vs the UHD and I also haven't torn a valve stem which I have seen with the UHD's. I only run 6-7 psi in my rears.

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Re: Neutech TuBliss (semi bliss)

Post by trailguy »

I've had great luck with the Gen 2 and stan's sealant. One trick you could try if you want to continue with the Tubliss system is adding art glitter. My Daughter had a boat load in her art supplies. I don't run this in motorcycle tires because Stan's is working great there, but I've used it in my mountain bike tires with amazing results, I run them tubeless, but I don't run tubeless tires because they are heavy so I run tube type tires with Stan's and glitter. I've had tires with 1/4" cuts in the sidewall that Stan's alone would not seal, drop in a teaspoon of glitter and the cuts seal instantly, never leaking again. For motorcycle tires I would use a good tablespoon of glitter with 3 or 4 oz. of Stan's.
You also need to make sure you are checking the inner bladder/tube air pressure at least once a week, I run 110 psi. In the front tire I run 7-9 psi, rear 3- 7 psi.
A couple of things to consider running tire sealants. They dry up over time, so if you leave your tires on for a long time you need to replenish the sealant. Slime doesn't work sealing bicycle tires and I would think it has the same result with MC tires. If you want to run Slime you need to pony up for Slime Pro sealant.

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Re: Neutech TuBliss (semi bliss)

Post by erniebearskin »

Thanks Dylan, I do recall talking about the glitter last year. I've never had an issue with the beads sealing, or with the inner bladder leaking. In fact the inner bladder holds air so well I'm just checking it every week or so now as it is always bang on. My only issue is with punctures and again I've only used this system with Dunlops AT81's. Care to divulge tires you have had good success with? :thinking:

Thanks folks all for the replies so far.
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Re: Neutech TuBliss (semi bliss)

Post by Metastable »

Question - If I were to decide to switch back to a conventional tube method, do you guys have any suggestions for plugging up the Tubliss valve stem?

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Re: Neutech TuBliss (semi bliss)

Post by takethebounce »

Metastable wrote:Question - If I were to decide to switch back to a conventional tube method, do you guys have any suggestions for plugging up the Tubliss valve stem?
a Piece of Foil tape on the inside should be more than suitable then rewrap with your choice of rim/duck/gorilla tape that you use.

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Re: Neutech TuBliss (semi bliss)

Post by trailguy »

Metastable wrote:Question - If I were to decide to switch back to a conventional tube method, do you guys have any suggestions for plugging up the Tubliss valve stem?
Fiberglass tape with a little silcone sealant in the hole. I would use the current tubliss rims lock/valve stem hole for the rim lock and the hole 4 spokes away for the tubes valve stem. This makes changing tires easier.

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Re: Neutech TuBliss (semi bliss)

Post by trailguy »

erniebearskin wrote:Thanks Dylan, I do recall talking about the glitter last year. I've never had an issue with the beads sealing, or with the inner bladder leaking. In fact the inner bladder holds air so well I'm just checking it every week or so now as it is always bang on. My only issue is with punctures and again I've only used this system with Dunlops AT81's. Care to divulge tires you have had good success with? :thinking:

Thanks folks all for the replies so far.
Fronts - Dunlop MX31, Mich M12, Kenda Milleville.
Rears - Dunlop MX 51, Mich S12, Kenda Trackmaster II, IRC M5B.
The only flat I've had in the last couple of years running the Gen 2 was on a well used M5B rear. I was on a ride that had several long steep hill climbs covered in sharp shale and I put several slices in the sidewalls and tread area. Like you mentioned Bryan, the tire still works well enough to finish the ride with zero air pressure.

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Re: Neutech TuBliss (semi bliss)

Post by axel99 »

trailguy wrote:
Metastable wrote:Question - If I were to decide to switch back to a conventional tube method, do you guys have any suggestions for plugging up the Tubliss valve stem?
Fiberglass tape with a little silcone sealant in the hole. I would use the current tubliss rims lock/valve stem hole for the rim lock and the hole 4 spokes away for the tubes valve stem. This makes changing tires easier.
This also works well if you decide to run bib mousse to keep alot of dirt out ot the tire
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