New bike prices… Are Japanese MX’rs worth modifying?

[cerealkiller]

I was recently toying with the idea of getting a new bike. After a little research I decided it isn’t worth it to me. I bought a 2012 KTM 350 XCF at the end of last year that still has pretty low hours (~60) and replacing it with a new 350 looks crazy expensive.

Still, in researching bike prices, I’m starting to wonder if when I do eventually get a new bike (probably next year) if buying a Japanese bike and modifying it for off-road might not actually be most cost-effective than purchasing a KTM/Husqvarna off-road model again. Seems like you could get a pretty tricked-out Japanese bike for much less than a stock KTM.

In my search I found 2014 250f’s as cheap as $5999 + GST for a RMZ250. Slap on a big bore kit because a 250f is a little bit puny IMO ($650 for a 270cc), an 18 inch rear ($350 from Tusk), a kickstand (PMB/trailtech for $150) and budget $1500 for a revalve and it seems like you’d have a pretty competent off-roader for <$9000.

Compare that to the lowest quote I got for a 2014 350 XCF at $10,998 (or $11,663 for a 2015) and I would still have to add at least new springs.

Also somewhat tempting was a leftover Husqvarna FE250 I saw for $8300. Add $650 for a big bore kit + $250 for new shock and fork springs and it would be $9200.

Again, I’m not following through with this plan since my current 350 is still pretty fresh, but for a budget-conscious off-roader in search of a new machine… this seems like a viable option.

Anything I’m not considering?

[erniebearskin]

But then its not built in Austria......no one will take you seriously......

$5999? that is cheap. Bike pricing is getting ridiculous, the bike then the extras + + + + + .

I wonder how a 250f with BB would work in the woods? Are they "peaky" with the power, would love to hear some feedback from someone with recent experience.

You're a great rider Jared, just man up and buy a 450, then you will always have lots of power on tap.

[cerealkiller]

Touche. I didn't include the cost of plastic kit to turn it orange.

Having never ridden a big bore 250, I'm curious how much the kit would help too. I also saw an RMZ 450 for $6999 -that might even be a better option considering you wouldn't have to big bore it.

[malcolmzilla]

Another consideration is that the Jap MX bikes have no stator power, and not many rewind options if any, not that the XCF's have a lot of wattage, but a headlight and/or heated grips are nice "trail" bike touches.

[cerealkiller]

That's a good point. If there are no stator options for a bike like the RMZ450, then running a headlight off a battery would be the only option and you'd be SOL on heated grips. If you can buy a high power stator, then it's a wash since I'd have to do the same for my XCF.

Also, no e-start. Can't believe I forgot about that.

[AJRJ]

Don't forget a close ratio transmission, and many budget components (non o-ring chain, sprockets levers etc.) On most of your Jap Bikes. Also resasle that is like 50% of what you pay (especially when modded).

Been there, done that and wouldnt go back.

[malcolmzilla]

Don't you have to kick that XCF anyhow?

cerealkiller.bmp (532.44 KiB) Viewed 755 times

[trailguy]

Also need to add a larger gas tank. I think the E-start is the deal breaker on a 4T if your racing offroad - moto not a big deal. Trying to lite a boiling hot 4T in a XC race can suck the wind out of ya.
In regards to 250F's, specifically 2013/2014 XCF 250F these absolutely rip. I've raced them offroad the last two season's and have no trouble keeping up with 350/450 or 300 2T on hills or moto style starts like at CMRC Corner Grass race this year. On the monster climbs at Marble MTN XC my 250F did great and I wasn't wishing I was on a bigger bike. I probably would not race/own a 2012 XCF as these made 35 HP, the 13/14 make 43 HP.

[thirtyseven]

Don't forget the clutch either....

[cerealkiller]

Ha ha. No, only if it misbehaves. I should probably remove my kickstarter to save a couple ounces. I've probably only touched it twice since I bought the bike. Both times were just experiments to see if I could get a better start by kicking and using the button at the same time (turns out, too many things for me to coordinate).

Yeah, I suppose I'd have to factor in a Rekluse to solve some of those issues. That should alleviate some concerns about starting, lack of hydro clutch - even the gearing somewhat since it's possible to gear a little higher with a rekluse in my opinion.

What else ya got?

Keep in mind, we'd be talking a $9500-10,000 450F now, but it would have the 18 inch rear, a kickstand, a headlamp, revalved/resprung suspension for off-road and my weight, a rekluse and a bigger tank. We still have $1000 to play with in accessories to alleviate any deficiencies before we reach the stock price of a 350f.

Edit: missed the post about sprockets and chain. I figure that another $200-250. BUT... I had to re-gear my 350 too.

[timbruce]

May want to toss in a fly wheel weight. So I have heard...

[malcolmzilla]

Recent case:

13 YZ250

Bare minimum OHV legal:
Add stator and DC reg/rec (max 36 watt only option)
Add BD S2 headlight/mask
Add tailight
Add battery and harness for above
Add exhaust with spark arrestor

Nice to haves:
Add flywheel weight
Add skid
Add 18" rear plus spokes (sold 19")
Add o-ring chain (once mx wore out)
Add sprockets/regear (-1 front, + 2 rear)
Add Clarke 3 gallon

Plus barkbusters, pipe guard, heated grips, disc guard, risers, etc to suit, but for apples to apples just listing the trail "necessities".

Stators piled up twice, leaving no timing/spark, in the bush, so:
Remove stator, (and throw it across staging lot), DC reg /reg
Remove headlight/mask, add barely legal battery powered light glued to mask
Tailight, no power
Remove battery, harness

Oh, and transfer cruise speed ~55 km/h off pipe, the close ratio seems nice once moving in the tight tho

I looked at a YZ, but then quickly realized that the Euro enduros have it cased trail wise, out of the box.

I have acquired a cheap BD S2 however.

[Dakota_c69]

I think the E-start is the deal breaker on a 4T if your racing offroad - moto not a big deal. Trying to lite a boiling hot 4T in a XC race can suck the wind out of ya.

I agree that this would be a deal breaker for me. Even though, the KX450 is s'posed to start pretty easily, but I wonder if that holds true when you have just dropped the boiling hot KX in 27 degree weather.

[boland]

Why not just buy a WR or CRF X?

[cerealkiller]

Not a bad idea, but I don't think the Japanese off-road models would be as competitive. Too heavy. Plus it less common to find one as a leftover for cheap. If you could, then I wonder how much weight could be shaved off...

I guess my point is that a Japanese mx bike could be nicely set up for racing for way cheaper than a Ktm.

E.g if you can get a 450 with woods tuned suspension and set up for the rider's weight, a rekluse, and all the necessary little mods for off-road and still be under the price of a STOCK 350 by a $1000... Seems tempting to me. I'm not saying the Ktm can't be made even better if you do the same mods, but that's turning into a pretty expensive machine.