Bike Selection Dilemma

[Brass]

One day, nomatter which bike you get you'll be lying underneath it thinking 1st" ohhh that hurt" 2nd "I wish this bike was lighter".

Yep, been in that position a time or 2
That certainly makes a strong case for the KTM 150xc.

[Bruce]

One of the most important things to me is how the bike "Fits". Everyone is built differently, has a different riding style and is comfortable on a certain type of bike. I'm 6'1" 2hundredandtoomuch lbs.
Here's a quick history on how I went from a 1987 Honda XR 250 to a 2009 Husaberg FE 570 in six years.
After a long (12 yr) absence from dirt biking (I grew up on one from 10-22yrs old), I thought I'd act on a whim and buy an XR 250 that I drove past. It was a dual purpose bike (which really means 'sucks equally on and off-road'). After a single trip up the Deerfoot and a single trip to the MX park (yup I took it there much to the amazement of many onlookers), I found a 1991 DR 350. It was heaps better than the XR in every way other than starting that pig! Next was a '98 KX 250. This thing was astounding and head and shoulders above the DR. It was FAST, nimble and fun. No electric anything, no lights, no kickstand etc. A 2001 YZ 250 was next. Same type of bike but way different fit. I liked the KX better so I got rid of the YZ. Hillclimbs on the KX or YZ was a multi-attempt thing that required microscopic throttle adjustments to keep enough power going to the ground without snapping the back end loose. I rode a friend's CR 500 (2t) and I was instantly drunk on the power! He told me it was the 2nd biggest 2t every made and 2nd most powerful (2nd only to the '94-'96 KTM 550 MXC). 1 month later I was putting my 1st tank of gas in my '95 KTM 550 MXC 2 stroke. This bike was STUPID! It was crude, LOUD, vibrated the hell out of the earth (and the riders giblets), not terribly well built, white and purple, made more power than a top fuel dragster and never, ever, in the history of mankind should this thing have been released on the general public! I kept it for a couple years for (I can't type without swearing. The word that I used is one of GC's 7 words that you can not say on television.)’s-n-giggles, threw a leg over it now and again when I thought I needed a good scare, let my buddies ride it for a good laugh at the faces they were wearing when they returned. It was a polarizing beast; It could give you have a smile that couldn’t be slapped off, or turn you as white as a ghost!
At this point I was riding a few times a year (10 hrs tops), had fun but I have plenty of other hobbies. I compete internationally in Hang Gliding and Paragliding so riding was far from the front and center activity for me.
After selling everything two-wheeled, my garage sat empty for about 2 weeks and I really noticed that I was feeling like I didn't have the option to ride and I missed it. Riding was a bit of freedom so even if I didn’t ride, I needed to know could by opening the garage door, loading up and heading out. Just the potential was a comfort to me. I found a 2003 KTM 450SXF on the Friday night of the July long weekend. Paid the man and loaded it up. I went to Waiporous with some friends and experience the joy of thumpers! This bike was kewl! Hillclimbing was easy, wheelies, easy, braking easy etc. Powerband thoughts faded away on this bike. Start at the base of the hill then drive up. Wanna go faster, add throttle. I think I moved up one skill level by getting on this bike. Missing was the flywheel weight, e start and kickstand. I owned it for 2 yrs until I broke my ankle in a hard Hang Gliding landing. Not sure if I would return to riding that year, I let a buddy buy it from me. By the end of the year I was all healed up. I found a 2004 WR450. Finally! Lights, e-start, kickstand and a 5 valve motor and a huge flywheel. It was with this bike that I found the RMDRA and was introduced to woods/single track riding last year. Having never been single track riding (I thought the destruction of the 4x4 and quad trails was all we had). I set up the WR for the woods and joined the wed night guided rides. Wow another steep learning curve that sent me on the quest for how to do this single track and log hopping stuff.
It was in my quest for knowledge, and a skill-set that I didn’t yet have, that lead me to the Shane Watts videos, reading research and having really great conversations with my new RMDRA riding buddies that I began to pull it all together. Bike set-up, riding while in the standing position, tire choice, line choice etc and now the glaringly obvious question... Does the bike fit me? After all is said and done, all the bolt-on’s, adjustments, set-up, tires riding style etc... Is my trusty and reliable WR450 the best fit?
Sadly it wasn’t the best fit for me. I found my back and neck getting sore despite trying different bars, bar settings etc. I broke my back at 19yr old in the T5-T7 area.
I started thinking of a new or new-to-me bike that fit me better. I liked plenty of things about the WR 450 and truthfully the bike was plenty advanced (better rider on less bike could have beaten me, and better rider on the WR and me on a current technology race bike would have left me in the dust as well). Basically I didn’t feel that the WR was holding me back.
Even with my skill level being the limiting factor, I started looking for a new bike. My order of importance looked something like this:
1) Fits ME
2) Handling and motor combination as good or better than the WR
3) Currently woods suitable (or easily converted for lights, kickstand etc)
4) Reliable and Low/ reasonable maintenance (WR is great for that)
5) Parts supply measured in days not weeks
6) Kewl and sexy lookin (chicks dig kewl bikes)
7) How much $ and perceived value per $ spent.
After riding the Husaberg, and being instantly amazed by the handling, I paid attention to the fit. It seemed much better than my WR without adjusting anything. Seemed to me I was off to a great start. I referred back to my list and decided I could probably make it fit me very well with an undermount kit for my Scotts dampener and if needed a taller set of bars. I felt comfortable on it. The handling was like my old KX 250 (it’s true what they say about these things), and the motor was smooth and very strong. Factory light kit. No negative reliability reports yet (but they are pretty new). KTM supported so the Husaberg elusive artist culture has taken a major move to the center for parts availability. Looks pretty sexy to me. And waaayyyyy too expensive unless you imagine owning it for a long time. The only thing I can say I prefer about the WR is the sound (it has a DrD exhaust that sounds like a musclecar). The Husaberg is quieter exhaust but the intake sound is far more prevalent due to the airbox location.
Bottom line is, if this bike fits me well, gives me less soreness in my upper back and neck, never leaves me stranded, is easy to maintain... it’s worth the Cake I had to part with to get it. If I can get the same % of potential out of this bike AND it has higher overall potential than the other bikes I’ve owned, I should become a better rider. Or.. I’m just trying to justify my decision! You decide. lol
Best of luck on what can be a super fun search for your next toy.
Bruce

[HollywoodMX]

I had a YZ250 as well, and while I agree they can be awesome woods bikes, here is the other side of the story (and probably true for any mx bike):

- The power comes on quick. This is fun to ride, but probably made me slower.
- The stock suspension will rattle your fillings out on roots and rocks
- The stock tank will run out of gas sooner
- There is no provision for powering lights which are required to be legal in our riding areas.
- There is no spark arrestor which is also required
- You'll want more flywheel whenever the ground is slick
- It won't have a kickstand unless you add one
- It will still have a 19" wheel unless you lace up an 18

Then you need to armor the bike properly, although that is true for most any bike.

So if you like to build your bike, the YZ can be a great option. I did a lot of this stuff, but never did the suspension work. Starting with a real enduro bike is going to be a lot easier and likely cheaper in the long run. If you still dabble in MX, the converted mx bike might make more sense for you.

As for your work schedule getting in the way all the time, life is too short to work that much...

My comments

- The power comes on quick. This is fun to ride, but probably made me slower.

Possible for sure for some. But if your riding for fun not a bad thing and loosing the 450 weight was enough to make me a better rider.

- The stock suspension will rattle your fillings out on roots and rocks

This is dependant on your weight of course. But one can say a revalve for woods riding is must for any bike even an enduro to fit to the riders specs properly.

- The stock tank will run out of gas sooner

This also could be said on any bike, hell even the GG & KTM 300's will eat more gas that a 250 and a 450. For 220.00 its a cheap remedy.

- There is no provision for powering lights which are required to be legal in our riding areas.

Yes and no. You are right, you can get inline and external stator's and they vary in price. But a $5.00 LED light also does the trick.

- There is no spark arrestor which is also required

This could be said about a lot of bikes, 130 bucks fixes that.

- You'll want more flywheel whenever the ground is slick

I took off my FWW years ago, not needed.

- It won't have a kickstand unless you add one

100 bucks gets you an awesome one.

- It will still have a 19" wheel unless you lace up an 18

18" tire is a luxury not a necessity. There was a test with pro riders in a mag a while back and stated the the 18" cost to benefit ratio was low. I have had both and noticed little to no difference. A good tire in either size makes a much larger difference ie: Dunlop MX 51.

[cedric]

My comments

- The power comes on quick. This is fun to ride, but probably made me slower.

Possible for sure for some. But if your riding for fun not a bad thing and loosing the 450 weight was enough to make me a better rider.

- The stock suspension will rattle your fillings out on roots and rocks

This is dependant on your weight of course. But one can say a revalve for woods riding is must for any bike even an enduro to fit to the riders specs properly.

- The stock tank will run out of gas sooner

This also could be said on any bike, **** even the GG & KTM 300's will eat more gas that a 250 and a 450. For 220.00 its a cheap remedy.

- There is no provision for powering lights which are required to be legal in our riding areas.

Yes and no. You are right, you can get inline and external stator's and they vary in price. But a $5.00 LED light also does the trick.

- There is no spark arrestor which is also required

This could be said about a lot of bikes, 130 bucks fixes that.

- You'll want more flywheel whenever the ground is slick

I took off my FWW years ago, not needed.

- It won't have a kickstand unless you add one

100 bucks gets you an awesome one.

- It will still have a 19" wheel unless you lace up an 18

18" tire is a luxury not a necessity. There was a test with pro riders in a mag a while back and stated the the 18" cost to benefit ratio was low. I have had both and noticed little to no difference. A good tire in either size makes a much larger difference ie: Dunlop MX 51.

Not trying to rain on your parade man, just putting down my opinions. All those $100, $200 and $500 fixes add up to a chunk of cash in the end. Don't get me wrong, I still miss my YZ, but there are other bikes out there. Ever try and ride out of the bush in the pitch dark with a $5 LED light? I have done it several times and it sucks bag.

[HollywoodMX]

Not trying to rain on your parade man, just putting down my opinions. All those $100, $200 and $500 fixes add up to a chunk of cash in the end. Don't get me wrong, I still miss my YZ, but there are other bikes out there. Ever try and ride out of the bush in the pitch dark with a $5 LED light? I have done it several times and it sucks bag.

No worries. I didnt think you were raining on my parade.

That chunk of cash that adds up that you mention, it's fair to say you will spend "some" of that on any of the bikes picked in that list these days. In the 4t world you will easily spend that cash in maintenance alone, that maintenance cost will hold zero resale value, at least the kick stand, a silencer can be parted out or sold for extra with the bike.

Basically to the OP, do you like a light or heavy bike, and do you like v8 or turbo, and do like honda maintenance costs or BMW maintenance costs. To me that's what dictates this persons decision ultimately in picking a bike.

[thirtyseven]

Get the bike that makes you feel like a sucsessfull kid. Ten bucks says if you get addicted you'll be looking to change in under 2yrs anyway, so buy the one that makes you giggle like a schoolgirl thinking about owning/riding it.

[Brass]

Thanks everyone for your input, you’ve all had some very good points.

I’m a bit surprised that there hasn’t been any comment made about the KTM 150, 200 or 250xc. On paper at least they seem to be very good bikes. Are they not well suited for riding in our area?

With the exception of the Berg, all the bikes are priced very close to each other. There may be a few dollars of difference but that is quickly eaten up by the extras that may or may not be needed. Although I don’t want to be throwing money away, the cost is not as important as the bike.

I’m 165lbs, 5’7” with a 30” inseam, so the jap bike that is made for an average Joe of 5’8” is a pretty close fit. The Euro bikes tend to be a bit more of a reach for me. With that said, I’m not afraid to change or have custom mounts made for the bars and pegs or a custom seat made. On the street I ride a 1250 Bandit that has gone through these changes and is now a perfectly tailored bike for me.

The 2t bikes are higher on my list than the 4t for maintenance reasons but that doesn’t mean the 4t is ruled out. Remember, I have one in the garage right now.

[Jaro51]

Don't right off the 250 4 strokers either. I have the same bike as Zeals (Husky TC250) and love it compared to the bigger 4 strokes. I've never been in a situation where I thought I needed more power but they are nice and light, easy to ride and forgiving. You can get in a lot of trouble real quick on the bigger bikes and if you don't ride often, having a bike you can hop on a few times a year and have a ball on is key, even if your buddies might beat you in a drag race. After 3 hours on the trails you'll be thankful for the easy power delivery and relatively mellow nature. I'm 6' 175 lbs btw and am a reasonable quick rider. I'm a believer in speed being more a result of rider/bike comfort and ability, not so much what bike you ride and what the stats and specs might say.

Whatever bike you get, you'll have a blast! Good luck on the choice!

[absurveyor]

I'll agree with Scott, except you can get rad guards for all bikes an this is a must!

If you can find the time to make it out to one of the Wednesday night Guided rides this is the perfect opportunity to try all of the bikes mentioned( Shameless Plug).
I am sure you can find 10 people that would let you try out their ride. That is the only way you will know what fits. With your size you might just consider a 250 4t or the 200 XC. Both very nice rides with suspension that puts my KLX in its place.

[HollywoodMX]

Thanks everyone for your input, you’ve all had some very good points.

I’m a bit surprised that there hasn’t been any comment made about the KTM 150, 200 or 250xc. On paper at least they seem to be very good bikes. Are they not well suited for riding in our area?

With the exception of the Berg, all the bikes are priced very close to each other. There may be a few dollars of difference but that is quickly eaten up by the extras that may or may not be needed. Although I don’t want to be throwing money away, the cost is not as important as the bike.

I’m 165lbs, 5’7” with a 30” inseam, so the jap bike that is made for an average Joe of 5’8” is a pretty close fit. The Euro bikes tend to be a bit more of a reach for me. With that said, I’m not afraid to change or have custom mounts made for the bars and pegs or a custom seat made. On the street I ride a 1250 Bandit that has gone through these changes and is now a perfectly tailored bike for me.

The 2t bikes are higher on my list than the 4t for maintenance reasons but that doesn’t mean the 4t is ruled out. Remember, I have one in the garage right now.

So at that weight you are pretty close to the average rider weight for some of those bikes so offroad or MX suspension you just might need a revalve and likely wont need new springs through that process which will save you 300 roughly bucks through that exercize. Being that your not that tall (like me) the top heavyness of a 4t vs a 2t will works against you in the woods. People like us have to get custom seats done but thats no big deal because in that process you can get them to make it softer too.

On the KTM's my thoughts are, 150 is not enough jam for your weight or suited for woods riding really. 200 if you like a more mello power band, and the 250 it's a nice bike for sure, has some benifits and some quirks over a YZ 250 but the KTM costs more compared to a YZ too. Persoanlly they are both great bikes, it might even come down to, do you feel more comfortable on a euro bike vs a Jap bike? There is a difference, I never felt right on the Gasser where I feel at home on a yamaha.

And if your a total blinger, then maybe buy something that will hold you for now and wait for the second year of the KTM 350 4t, lincked usspension with fuel injection! That will be a sweet 4t IMO.

[Zeal]

I think you would have got an overwhelming ktm 200 recommendation if you had mentioned your weight and height from the beginning. Anything bigger than a 250 is the wrong bike for you... unless you want to be that guy who is always holding the group up, even when you are riding with 10 year olds.

Regarding the 150, I happened to be passed last weekend by one of our local pros. When I stopped to chat at the trucks, I noticed he was riding a 150 XC with no rear studs. He said he weighed 160 lbs. He was flying on the 150, trust me, it has enough jam.

Anyway, the 200 will be more forgiving, and is the bike for you.

I would recommend the gasgas because it is a great bike, and will fit you way better than a ktm.

Zeal

[HollywoodMX]

I think you would have got an overwhelming ktm 200 recommendation if you had mentioned your weight and height from the beginning. Anything bigger than a 250 is the wrong bike for you... unless you want to be that guy who is always holding the group up, even when you are riding with 10 year olds.
Zeal

Dude that's a totally rude comment. You dont know him, you dont ride with him. The bike for him is the one he likes the most, most comfortable with and is happy riding, not CC or 2t-4t restricted. His confidence that he will have riding the right bike for him will out weigh any reservations of his height and weight.

He is looking for opinions not firm direction of what he should and shouldnt be able to ride...

[steve-o]

I think you would have got an overwhelming ktm 200 recommendation if you had mentioned your weight and height from the beginning. Anything bigger than a 250 is the wrong bike for you... unless you want to be that guy who is always holding the group up, even when you are riding with 10 year olds.
Zeal

Dude that's a totally rude comment. You dont know him, you dont ride with him. The bike for him is the one he likes the most, most comfortable with and is happy riding, not CC or 2t-4t restricted. His confidence that he will have riding the right bike for him will out weigh any reservations of his height and weight.

He is looking for opinions not firm direction of what he should and shouldnt be able to ride...

I really think that you are taking what Zeal said out of context. I know where he is coming from by saying this. I would make the same recommendation.

These 'what bike should I buy' threads usually get out of hand.

Just so you know ZEAL has had every bike under the sun, and his recommend holds alot of VALUE.

[Rider Eh!]

+1 for Zeal and steve-o's comments.

I'm pretty sure I wouldn't go any faster on a 300, and I'm 6'2, 175lbs, mid level Intermediate racer. Bigger bike means more tired due to too much power, if you can't throw it around. Last I remember speaking to Jack Sawatsktobogan (top local pro), he prefers the 250 over the 300 as well.

I know a guy about the same size (DoC) who use to ride a 250, and has stepped over to the KTM 200 and loves the thing. He's quicker too.

It's no fun riding a bike to big for you in the local woods, hence why I don't take the XR650R on the trails too much!

[HollywoodMX]

I think you would have got an overwhelming ktm 200 recommendation if you had mentioned your weight and height from the beginning. Anything bigger than a 250 is the wrong bike for you... unless you want to be that guy who is always holding the group up, even when you are riding with 10 year olds.
Zeal

Dude that's a totally rude comment. You dont know him, you dont ride with him. The bike for him is the one he likes the most, most comfortable with and is happy riding, not CC or 2t-4t restricted. His confidence that he will have riding the right bike for him will out weigh any reservations of his height and weight.

He is looking for opinions not firm direction of what he should and shouldnt be able to ride...

I really think that you are taking what Zeal said out of context. I know where he is coming from by saying this. I would make the same recommendation.

These 'what bike should I buy' threads usually get out of hand.

Just so you know ZEAL has had every bike under the sun, and his recommend holds alot of VALUE.

Reccomending a 200 is completely kosher with me, I get that. Saying anthying bigger than that is the wrong bike for him and 10 year old's are gonna out ride him is a ignorant statement weather he's ridden 2 bikes or 100 bikes in his lifetime.